Oh , I had plans to make a dump thread on artists I watched/followed/faved on Pixiv (and Tinami later on) , as an assurance . Anyone here want it ?Still anticipating ...
Has anyone felt sick? Every now and then I get sick. My stomach and head hurt and one of my eyes hurt. It really bothers me and then once I sleep it off, I feel perfectly fine.
And for some reason some of the better choices dropped out.Perfectly shows what USA had become lately . EU nation will be next after that , from what I've heard (or it's already happening) ...
It seems like we've got a guest or two popping up regularly on this site . Who could that be ...Probably me. I check this site without logging-in every now and then.
Yah I just don't bother trying to fix auto correct anymore. It's super annoying. I remember it wasn't so invasive.I find it amusing though , to see what an AI perceive a non-English word to be as . My username and "Nico Nico" being a few of those .
Curiosity hits me so here's a random question.
What's the purpose of that "line" on the fabric on the upper thigh part.
If I see it again I will make an indefinite bam. But I just want to make sure it's not a bot. The posts have varied a bit. If it happens again it will be an indefinite ban. For these kinds of things I usually would ban the UP as well.
Indeed . Those alternative IPs produced by proxies may hinder the effectiveness of IP banning .
I lurked Mangaraiders a few days ago (I won't post anymore there indefinitely) and stumbled upon this thread (http://forums.mangaraiders.com/index.php/topic,17522.msg277323/topicseen.html#msg277323) . Of course it's locked now , but before that there were lots of posts questioning the OP . But that's not what piqued my curiosity (I might make an advisory thread on spotting red flags in the business of collaboration) - this did (https://www.zovelia.com/) , mentioned by the OP .
Upon further digging or not even much for the red flag to be raised , the service page leaves an odd taste . Why would you pay for a spot in their publishing company ? Very sketchy ...
I might also want to open a megathread that lists all publishers that are not trustworthy like what AbsoluteWrite does for their fellow writers . But I think a regular thread will do , for now ... the question is , where do I put it at ?
Another reason I kinda like this forum, as quiet as it can be sometimes: it's not full of braindead zombies who would actually fall for that kind of thing. Maybe the age average is a little higher over here, or I dunno.I know of younger people who're smarter than me in real life , provided they were offered the best education can offer . Otherwise , one has to learn things the hard way , like I did (my IQ is just above average) .
I've been finishing up on some things and heard Beauty and the Beast is getting controversy and I can't help but say Disney deserved it.
They changing the plot and turning a character gay and promoting it to give themselves a pat on the back.
I've been using XP ever since and just changed to win7 this year.I hope that it'll remain so . Right now , I'm saving money on upgrading my PC just so my Photoshop don't choke when used for too long . Also , I need more space for all of my movie and song clutters ...
I also use both FireFox and Chrome that time and even though they don't get updates anymore, they still worked fine for me.
Our spammer is back at it again. This time he's posting on other people's post. If it gets out of hand I'll take care of it.The same Dragonball game promo . Does that still not scream spambot to you ?
Bumping in to say hi for now . Now I had to juggle two jobs again , I find getting free time really difficult .
Still , I had not forgotten my promise to deliver something I had in mind before ...
Wow, just accidentally stumbled on this place in my bookmarks and... Didn't expect it to still be up and running. I'm impressed.You're underestimating us XD
Not really back, but just to leave a note or two.
I've got no internet. I'm typing this from a cybercafe because my line had gone kaput due to backed payment.
I'm only here to take my story into my pen-drive just so I can do some more proofreading but again, work come first and in addition to that, I'm also resuming making one-shots. So this project, 'La Sanctum' is temporary shelved... partially.
And I'll get into responding once I get my line back. Until then, I'd be offline...
Well fuk me, the entire chapter 4 of 'La Sanctum' has gone scrapped by mis-editing of post. Any way to revert it on your end, admin?
Heya all. Apologies for the most recent absence. Real life took over once again. Nice to see there's still a bump or two here and there. I'll be around but if anybody likes they can hit me up on Discord, just shoot me a PM for my ID. I'll peek back at least once a week to check in on the community!
You won't see much of me here anymore. Unfortunately.
^ Maybe because this site is barely breathing.
Although the goal of the forum is to improve our writing skills specifically intended for manga. Do any of you have anything remotely close to that?
DeAngelus deactivated his account.
I thought this forum had a good start but this site is so dead. :\
And no matter how many times i broke down the fundamentals of good story pacing and character development and no matter, it would not stick.
Yes it seems strange in hindsight. I don't know exactly why we always had a misunderstanding there, and maybe that's why I can't promise that things will be any different. Nowadays I can sort of pick stories apart as I read or watch them and I can genuinely predict what will happen next or why some things do happen. Which is something I've never been able to come close to doing before.
I think that we both heavily disagreed on what a character actually was. Which made it difficult for me to produce a character to your liking. You wanted a character this way, I wanted a character that way. You wanted the story to do this, I wanted the story to do that. What's worse is by the time FNO was even posted here, it already lost its true meaning. The real story I wanted to tell had been destroyed and I had no idea what I was doing with it, except I deluded myself into thinking I knew what I was doing with it.
The intentions or "agendas" behind each story were not something you were allowed to know, and it's hardly something I could explain in a few words, except through reading the story. Blade Regalia seemed to make a statement on Religion, but it really never did. The whole garden of eden thing was just an origin story, it could've said evolved over millions of years and it still wouldn't be making a statement yet. It does set us up for the statements it does make, but you never read anything about that, and that is my fault entirely.
We could look at the Cannibal which kind of looks like it could be a serial work, but it really makes the most complete statement. But again, to my poor skill, it is missing some of it. To put into perspective how complicated it gets, the cannibal is told from the perspective of the antagonist. The girl directly represents an abuser. The story is meant to humanize her and help you empathize with her to ultimately change your perspective on the victim. And there's more going on there that we're missing, but that's the gist.
I am an artist first and foremost. And that's what artists do when we're not doing functional art we're making statements. The FNO that you read, kind of deals with similar ideas and it also mixes up the roles, and instead of just swapping antagonist and protagonist, it's mixed up around 3 people. You always felt negatively towards Tara and you never thought of her as a strong female lead, but that was kind of intentional. She's playing the victim, but she's not blameless. She's almost asking for pain. That's typically not what you want in a victim, but that's what a lot of victims are, and a lot abusers aren't one-dimensionally demons sometimes. (I'm not saying like if you die in a terrorist attack then you asked for it.) Tara really takes that idea to the extreme, and the Cannibal takes that idea to the extreme as well.
That's one of those things were I wanted something, and you wanted something else. You can't just simply teach someone how to make art, it's more complicated than that. I never felt confident enough in it to call it art, but if I did, I think it would have made it easier for us to understand where our misunderstandings are really stemming from.Everything that you work on where you put effort, and soul into it is considered art. But make no mistake, not all stories are 100% art. Stories has always been a compromise one way or another to maximize entertainment. There's a structure, there's a goal. There's pacing, setup, etc.
Why does illustration get a pass, but storytelling doesn't? I think that's very inconsistent. You're not thinking of it as art if that's the case. Picasso draws bad drawings. We call it abstract. I wrote bad stories, we call them bad? You're as conservative of stories being told a certain way as many people are of artwork being realistic. A lot of people don't like to look at abstract art at all.
What I believe art is, and I promise is the best definition you will find anywhere besides some crazy dude saying "everything": Non-functional aspects of something. That's the bare minimum where I look at something and think of it as art, but it's also anywhere where a statement is being made.Of course art can be based entirely on its function (kinetic sculptures). So your definition is definitely a flawed one.
So you can see right here. Instantly. We have a different set of philosophical beliefs. You only think of a story as something that functions in a specific way. You leave no room for it to be artistic, no room to appreciate anything beyond its function. Just as most people leave no room for abstract art. Most people believe illustration's function is to be realistic. Before cameras were invented, it was, but that's no longer necessary.
I'm not against the idea of personality. I'm not even against good story telling. I know you probably think I am.
Me personally, on a completely personal level, I would rather read something that changes my way of thinking rather than just wastes my time. That's why it's important to me to write that way.I'm pretty sure every artist and writer wants to achieve this to some degree with their story. or at least provoke a thought and feeling to invoke change just as much as a feeling.
We have totally different beliefs on a philosophical level. As I said, you want this, I want that. Biggest difference between Picasso and I is Picasso actually knew what he was doing when he did it. Maybe no one is the target audience, maybe everyone is. Maybe you're not the target audience for reasons much deeper than just your age, ethnicity, gender, and religion, which would be the case for other stories.i want good story. and i dont know what you want, but i know objectively, you dont want a good story.
You actually consider kinetic art functional? That's funny. I see we have very different philosophies on function. I can't do anything with a kinetic sculpture. Movement is not a function. What you're referring to is an "Action". An action and a function are two different things. I'm going to keep using that phrase different philosophy, different philosophy, different philosophy, different philosophy, different philosophy, different philosophy. If you want an agreement, you have to first accept why our opinions are different.
Did you honestly think I go to art school and never thought about kinetic art. You had to have been drawing at straws. I spent hours trying to figure out how you can fit architecture into that description, and you bring up kinetic art. Because for instance in art history, they usually pay attention to architecture as well as religious art which seems very functional. And there's a reason why it still works, but I'm not going to get into that.Based on the anime art i've seen, the lack of real-world proportions integrated into them, i wouldn't have imagined you were in art school. If you were in the art school i was in, they would've asked you to stop drawing anime altogether and focus on proportions and realism. And for good reason as it would get in the way of learning proper proportions and form. Its not that my art school wants me to quit altogether, but most people use it as a crutch.
Commercial art has a function. And that function is to be pleasing to the consumer. It has nothing to do with it being representational, it has nothing to do with color, or line in isolation, it has to do with the consumer. The consumer is in complete control of the illustration being made. That is not art. That is business.You mean the client. The client has complete control of the illustration. And if they did, they wouldn't hire an artist to do it. And it is intended to be pleasing to the consumer. That is for sure. But don't understimate how much work and skill that actually takes.
If you asked me what is my artwork supposed to make you feel. It would be stupid to answer that. Answering that only serves to belittle the effectiveness of it. What art makes you feel is personal to you.
Again philosophical disagreement. Kinetic art is not functional. An action is not a function. At least to me, it's not. That's my philosophy. Maybe that's not your philosophy, it doesn't actually matter to me. You could say its function is to move, but the movement that takes place is artistic because it could make any movement. Why does it move the way it does if it could move any way it wanted? Why does a painting look the way it does if it could look like anything it wanted? That is art.you're just contradicting yourself.
This actually isn't an argument. This is a discussion. You are the one who refuses to discuss. I simply stated, that we disagree. I stated what I believe and then you argued against it. If you don't want to argue, stop arguing and start discussing.i don't want to hear that we have differences in philosophies as to why you're not progressing or that we want different things out of your story. That throws out all the valid critique on your stories.
"What is your story suppose to make me feel when i read it?" And you simply could not answer it.So i'm going to say this: if you can't answer this question, that is the reason you've never been able to progress. You never tried to control the audiences feelings and thoughts through story telling.
This is one of those things where I felt answering the question would be considered an argument. Obviously I was correct because you refuse to have a discussion.
My perspective on characters and storytelling in general has actually changed since the time I wrote FNO, but for me it was important that the character plays his role. I was always looking at the story as a whole. You were looking at the details. I think over time I could have gone back and fixed some of the elements and details that were distracting.
There were some characters whose role was to have a personality. Their role in the story revolved entirely around how it would feel to interact with them. We can continue to compare FNO to art here it'd be as if I drew Tara from FNO and one arm was too small. Even if it was intentional, the statement the piece was making had nothing to do with proportion or arms or anything, the arm could be regualar sized, and the statement would be the same, right. I'm still speaking Hypothetically here, in the art world we could call that small arm "distracting". The arm is completely distracting from the actual message of the piece and should be changed.
That's a similar problem with Tara and FNO or Blade Regalia, is that the poor elements of the story are distracting you. The story's message doesn't revolve around Tara's personality, but the fact that she didn't have one, was distracting. And that should be fixed. If the story were making a statement on personality, or the abstract personalities as a whole were in of themselves making a statement, then that would make more sense from an artistic point of view.Its more than just distracting. Its the fact that she had no personality meant you really didn't think deeply into what your audience should feel. (i'm sounding repetitious on purpose because you have to acknowledge these aspects)
Blade Regalia did create some challenges for me because it was a commercial work, however. The story was going to be illustrated or animated and free to view even without having bought the game. It was purely a service to the gamers, not as a commercial venture. The game itself, was not story driven. It's multiplayer. That being the case I wanted to pursue it as some kind of median between artistic and commercial venture.This is the compromise i'm talking about. Just because its not what you originally envisioned or had to make compromises, doesn't mean you stop calling it art.
What has changed is now the game is also story driven, and that's lead me to make some changes. So now it's much more commercial than artistic. I still love it. I love seeing what it's becoming. I agree that's definitely a mistake not to explore the world or to explore who Katherine is because even within the game the world is very expansive lore wise. It begs you to learn more about it. You do have different cultures and different races and the different Regalia depending on it and it's really fun to explore now. I agree there were missteps there.
You're not Real probably has a lot of potential just by the name. But the story itself is not good. The protagonist is based on a character from Blade Regalia by the same name who actually is a sociopath. But in Blade Regalia he's an antagonist.This was a problem. You can't just switch out a role and put it on that character's perspective and assume people will relate or connect with the character. So why do people want to follow a sociopath in a story? Theres no redeeming quality. At that point, we're just seeing a sociopath be a sociopath. It doesn't service the audience.
The story didn't really say anything either. I thought it would be interesting to push the idea that "love didn't exist" or that love was specifically the "You" the title is referring to, but the protagonist was poorly executed. Now I can look at it and see some things that would've made it work a lot better. If the protagonist's struggles seemed more unfair, then it might have been more interesting, but I didn't like the protagonist either. I didn't know how to fix him. You gave me solutions, but they wouldn't solve the bigger problem so I abandoned it. I would basically just have to torture the protagonistSo this is where story telling is different. We're creating essentially real people. And the goal is that these characters are believable. And if we want to achieve something out of them, we have to manipulate their surroundings to fit that purpose.
Function exists within art, yes. A painting's function is to be seen. It has a function. I agree. But what is artistic is what's done beyond that function. As I a said the "non-functional aspects". I did not say "art is an object that doesn't perform ANY function". Art is the aspects of an object that are not pertaining to its function. There is function within objects, but not in art. Art is not just an object.you said non-function in your definition. its too specific and really has no need. you're overexplaining it. Non-function isn't a key factor to art. There are cathedrals and castles that the way they approach function is considered art. Its not worth arguing/discussing and you know it.
So if you're a slave owner. And you have complete control of a slave. You're saying you wouldn't need a slave to do anything if you have control over him? An artist has a skill you need. You pay money, he illustrates in the same way that a painter puts paint on a brush in order to paint. They both want a picture, they both do what they need to do to make it happen.
In a way we could technically say that the client is the artist, and the illustrator is just a medium that the client uses to illustrate. We can call it artistic because the consumer can spend his money on whatever he wants, but the fact that he spends it on that illustration is in of itself making a statement.You're right. in a way, you could technically say that....
Yes, the client doesn't always specify every single little detail about a piece so the artist does have to invent some ideas and that is artistic because it extends past the clients demands into the artist's liberty of choice among a series of choices. Another way to look at art, it is a choice among many choices.
Storytelling's function is to be read or heard. Period. You can ascribe golden rules to story telling if you would like. The consumer can ascribe golden rules to stories he would purchase if he chooses. Commercial storytelling doesn't even follow your golden rules. SAO for instance. Where are Kirito's flaws at? But still a hugely successful product. Different people do have different standards. A lot of people don't pay attention to personality at all. Do I think it's better that characters have a personality? On a personal level, yes I do.No. Not period. The act of being heard/read shares an intention again that correlates with illustration and that is still to invoke thought/feeling.
I think the fact that you can't see a correlation between story-telling and illustration is very simple-minded. That's just my opinion. Maybe I think too much about everything.No, you're just using our different views as a way to push an extreme (like when you compared commercial art to slaves)
As of this discussion, perhaps I did in the past because I was prideful, but as of this discussion. I have not once excused any mistake I've made. I have done more to recognize how to fix them than you have. I explained why they happened. But I did not argue that they made the story better.then we shouldn't be arguing about commercial art and how different you see story-telling.
In the past I've never actually taken it seriously when you'd say I don't put the audience first. Or I don't care about the audience.. That's mostly why you don't feel like you've ever gotten a good answer. I know what Katherine looks like. I know what she acts like and what wants. Why would I draw a picture of her? So that I'll know what I already know? Why would I write about her?
You could say the audience is the only reason she exists, but the reason why I never told you that Tara is supposed to make you feel like she's a victim who isn't blameless is the same reason why artists don't explain their art. I want you to have your own personal experience, or revelation, or emotion, from it. I want Tara to open up a discussion, not simply be a sentence.we never got far into the story to ever reach any of these ideas (look at previous joke analogy). First few chapters were always flawed to the core, that we couldn't move forward.
I could go back and tell you every single emotion you were meant to feel in FNO and Blade Regalia, and why all those years ago you were meant to feel that way, and I could even tell you why you didn't feel that way. I didn't want to tell you that, because I wanted you to have your own interpretation. Could it have helped us figure out solutions had I told you? Yes. Obviously it could have. I made a mistake. I've made many. I'm used to it.