Author Topic: Manga and crowdfunding (Read 730 times)

Lumaria · « **on:** July 09, 2016, 04:52:01 am »

You probably don't hear this a lot but a lot of manga fans want to use crowdfunding such as Kickstarter and indiegogo.

Here's some examples:

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/heart-of-wildfire-project#/

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/tephlonfunk/tephlon-funk/description

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1718932295/run-remember-ur-nature-parkour-manga-volume-1/description

Some are considered successfully funded. But, after that things get really slow. I wanted to know what your thoughts are on it.

My opinion on this is mixed. I definitely remembered these series before. Such as Heart of wildfire which still seams extremely flawed to this day. And other series such as Kickstarter.

Normally I recommend that if your series is finished, look for a publisher. A well known publisher that has recently published something good and not on the amateur spectrum.

Crowdfunding is finding the next ignorant person to get swept up in the hype. And i usually say that because they use excitement and not really show us how helping them succeed will prove to be worth it for those who support it.

There are other projects that I'm happy were fully funded (Bloodstained:Ritual of the night) but I wouldn't go to crowdfunding unless I had a really convincing argument as to why my ideas can win over the general oublic, and if they can, I'd still look for a licensed publisher.

And when these campaigns fail, they just find another route. Unfortunately they don't learn from them. In fact, I noticed a lot that those who make these campaigns end up not taking in any criticism even if they claim that they do.

What do you all think about relying on crowdfunding?

HematoLogMeIn · « **Reply #1 on:** July 09, 2016, 08:25:50 am »

Hmm...If crowd funding were used as a bridge between production and going to a publisher, I think it's a wonderful way for the artist (using that loosely here, be it literary or visual artist, or even performance artist) to make sure that they can support themselves until finalizing the project.

Relying solely on crowd funding isn't something I'm entirely against either, because to me, it isn't about whether a work is "published" or "indie", it's whether it's good or not. I don't think it takes anything away from the work to have it funded one way or another.

KB · « **Reply #2 on:** July 09, 2016, 10:31:59 am »

honestly I don't think the way you get your work published matters, so long as the work itself is good. Kickstarter, Indie , experienced publisher the only thing that matters is that work itself.

Lumaria · « **Reply #3 on:** July 09, 2016, 03:06:59 pm »

My biggest problem with crowdfunding however is that it makes it easier to sell a bad, flawed, or unrefined concept.

I don't knock the idea of getting published so long as it's good either. But that's not always the case when it comes to these.

HematoLogMeIn · « **Reply #4 on:** July 09, 2016, 03:43:09 pm »

I'm just gonna throw out there that Twilight of all things managed to be published professionally, so I'm gonna say that's a two-way street. Not everything that gets published is top-notch work either.

Lumaria · « **Reply #5 on:** July 10, 2016, 06:52:02 am »

Books is very different then comics. And Twilight was very lucky. Twilight was rejected multiple times by multiple publishers and even once it got published, it happened to have a roll of its own.

The right people happened to bring it out of the shadow.

But like I said, I feel Kickstarter makes it easier. Especially since you just invest in someone before seeing what the final product will look like or so.

HematoLogMeIn · « **Reply #6 on:** July 10, 2016, 07:09:54 am »

I still can't bring myself to think of that as a bad thing, per se. Even low-qual artists have to eat, after all. Besides, if people want to invest their own money on something uncertain that may have a poor product outcome, who's to tell them not to? Free markets are strange places. I personally wouldn't invest in something unless I knew that I appreciated what I invested in, kind of like streaming a few song clips from an album before buying it.

These things like kickstarter only expand the free market, giving consumers more products to choose from. You could certainly make the argument that too much choice might lead people to do stupid things, and I'd agree with you there, but for what it's all worth, I feel that something like this is fairly harmless. Someone asks for money, and some people give it of their own free will. Kind of anti-climatic if you ask me. Hoopla.

Lumaria · « **Reply #7 on:** July 10, 2016, 07:13:43 am »

It's their choice to invest in someone. And I'm not arguing about that.

But I've seen writers and artist just not learn from the experience enough or don't learn the same things they do when they do get published.

You're trying to argue the backers. I'm more tackling the people who choose to rely on crowdfunding for distribution.

Technically once it's out there it's already published. So they don't have to go to a licensed publisher or crowdfunding. But by the act of choosing either is trying to make a work worth looking at.

One just has a better learning process.

HematoLogMeIn · « **Reply #8 on:** July 10, 2016, 09:13:27 am »

You're probably absolutely right that they won't learn as much this way as they would through the publishing and rejection process, but there are many paths to being an artist, and this is one of them. You don't have to like them, nor their work, nor their methods, but if they get successful from it, then that's just how life works.

Sure, it can be a little unfair when someone with limited skill makes it big while someone who's been working for years honing their craft sees no return on their investments in their work, but this whole business is one of chance. Not everyone goes about things the same way, and not everybody has the self-driven motivation to constantly improve and get better. We can argue all day whether or not that complacence some people have is healthy or not, but that doesn't erase their success if they make it.

No path is greater or less than another. While we can certainly argue that some are more moral, or respectable, in the end, it's a matter of "did you get what you want?" and not everybody wants the same things. You clearly value diligence, and self-progression, and lifelong learning, and this may be a wild guess, but I'd gather that you're a bit of a perfectionist. None of these things are inherently bad. That's just the path you're on. We're actually quite similar in that regard, albeit in different places. Even then, we're still clearly on two separate journeys of life.

There's really infinite potential in everything, and that infinity goes in both directions: Infinite potential for success, and for failure. As such, one can rebound from a rejection or make it through on something like this. Both are still examples of the infinite ways the potential of success can be attained. In a way, not having that extra experience or guidance or learning could be taken as a failure, but again, different people want different things.

Bah, this is getting overly-philosophical over a simple question. I hope it doesn't sound too heated. I'm really just musing with my fingers on a keyboard.

Orchid · « **Reply #9 on:** July 11, 2016, 06:02:14 am »

My personal experience from kickstarter has been bad. MIGHTY No.9 really burned me.
Even the most professional developers screw up such awesome idea.

Crowdfunding for manga? I haven't heard of it. But people do what they want I guess. It doesn't sound too different from being self published, right? Sounds like deviant art to me.

I can see what everyone saying. I guess it's the crowdfunding trend. But for books and comics, it's different right?

How do you sell a story they've never read or think is good? With mighty no.9 I was promised a demo and I played them. The concept was right and we got to see more of it.

I'm really burned about that game though, so I'm super bias (Sorry :C). I don't think all kickstarter are bad but I personally think people have been leaning on kickstarter for everything.

Indiegogo. Never heard of that either but they get to keep the money even if it fails? That just a get out of jail free card!!

I have no real judgement on manga though. I never heard of these manga but reading them through, they seem like stuff I already see in deviantart.

Lumaria · « **Reply #10 on:** July 11, 2016, 08:08:26 pm »

I think there's something different about DA vs Kickstarter or any crowdfunding.

Especially with Indiegogo. They take that money anyways even if it's a proven failed concept.

My problem with kickstarter or posting an original concept that is relying on how it looks and how the story is told is that it's impossible, and little room for review and take in opinions.

I think there's a lot more room to be selfish and ignorant and arrogant with self funding. Not that these projects are that. And some of these projects have proven to be that. Not mentioned which one.

I'm not trying to clip their wings, I just think they still need to remember to improve. Even tenured writers who have been published or help others get published revise their own work.
.

Orchid · « **Reply #11 on:** July 12, 2016, 12:52:14 am »

I guess . It's just not common enough for me to have a solid opinion on it.

Crackhead Johny · « **Reply #12 on:** July 12, 2016, 12:03:01 pm »

I looked into it a while back.
Unfortunately it has a real hard time working, so most of what you see is terrible Baddest man Alive fighting manga with art done by a 6th grader or no art at all.
These are put up by dreamers who are not critical of their own work and you see things like 5 donors (probably family and friends) and 25$ out of goal that they clearly never thought through. If they want to make an anime the end goal is usually through through even less (like 5000$ to make a 13 ep anime)

The reason this is destined to fail, usually is because if you have enough story/product to get backers, you are already at the point you can publish on Amazon. So if you have created a book or two you can get backers but you can also just go publish that on Amazon and cut out the middle man. Sure if you are Yukito Kishiro (battle angle) you can run a successful campaign on nothing but name but there are only a handful of people on the planet like that. The rest of us have to have something to show. If I go this route it would be to convert a book I already have successfully selling on Amazon into manga or anime.

"I have this story about the baddest man alive (who is based on me!) please fund me! this will be so awesome! I promise!" is just going to fail.

Lumaria · « **Reply #13 on:** July 14, 2016, 08:08:07 pm »

I think that's exactly the problem. Manga artist out there use these campaigns to sell their dreams, but not sell something for the people and that's what makes it worst to crowdfund.

Yes some may do it for the goodness of their heart but others (like myself) ask what it will contribute to pop culture or just general cult status items.

Some of them may have an interesting concept, but I noticed that they usually fall back and say "these aren't flaws or holes. This is just my style of writing."

I would like to see a manga crowdfund ingredients campaigned that tells us reasons why they need this money (estimated time and schedule and back up plans) along side why their story is something worth reading.

Orchid · « **Reply #14 on:** July 16, 2016, 06:00:36 pm »

So what would the dream manga crowdfund campaign be?

News:

User

Stats ezBlock

Author Topic: Manga and crowdfunding (Read 730 times)

Lumaria

Manga and crowdfunding

HematoLogMeIn

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

KB

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Lumaria

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

HematoLogMeIn

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Lumaria

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

HematoLogMeIn

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Lumaria

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

HematoLogMeIn

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Orchid

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Lumaria

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Orchid

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Crackhead Johny

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Lumaria

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Orchid

Re: Manga and crowdfunding

Recent Topics